Serial Entrepreneur Club – EP69: PR Basics for Small Businesses

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You’re listening to the serial entrepreneur club hour. We run this show every week, two o’clock Eastern, but you can also listen to it on your favorite podcast channel. Uh, if you search serial entrepreneur club and any podcast network we are available, and we have almost 70 episodes, it’s been very exciting and last week we had a great show, right?

 Michele, we had a great show on minor majors. Yeah. It was a really, um, well received show. We’ve been getting lots of, um, People saying that they took a lot away from it. And if you want to see it, actually hear it you can go to ww.startup.club and you can, um, hear it as well as see our blog [00:01:00] post.

Thank you. Yeah, absolutely. And I think the ultimate minor major is PR you know, how is how as a startup, can we achieve amazing things without investing a lot of money? Like let’s face it let’s face the reality. Most of. The startups that launch don’t have the kind of big budgets that big companies have.

So we have to think a little bit more innovative and I think the ultimate minor major is PR and that’s what we’re gonna talk about today with David Libby. And I’m hoping to really get into it. And if you are in the audience and you want to share a, a PR tip, please raise your hand. Now we want you on stage.

Or if you have a question for David, please, you know, please join us on stage. Uh, I would also ask that, uh, everyone on stage and in the audience, if you could share the room with the rest of the clubhouse, that would be great, cuz I know there’s a lot of people who want to hear today’s show Jeff, welcome as well.

I know you’re an expert at PR [00:02:00] over the years, you’ve done so many things in, uh, the companies that I’ve worked with you on around PR, including, you know, recently the gift guide. I thought that was a really neat thing. Um, but we’ll get to you to you in a minute, Jeff, and then David, uh, welcome. Welcome to the show.

Thanks so much calling to Michele. Good to see you, Jeff. So we have some questions. Good to see you as well. David, why don’t you kick it off Jeff? Well, I mean, David is our, our guest of the day, but I’ll just say that PR you know, is a great topic. And I think a lot of people sometimes misunderstand, um, the value of real PR and earned media versus paid media.

Um, and you know, a lot of people because of social media have veered away from some of the more traditional PR tactics, but many of those tactics, as I’m sure David will talk about still can have a tremendous [00:03:00] impact and a lot of value today. So there there’s all sorts of things to talk about. So I look forward to the conversation.

Uh, great. Uh, so David, can you just, first of all, Tell us what PR is and how much of an impact it can have on a startup. Absolutely. Thanks, Colin, and, and good to hear and see everybody down there in the audience. And, and I’m really, really flattered to me, uh, you know, asked to come up on stage and, and share, you know, close to public relations experience that I’ve had.

And it’s pretty broad from entertainment to B2B tech share. And hopefully this folks down in the audience will get, you know, some applicable advice that they can take home or TA Tums their home offices and, and make it real. And, you know, what’s great question cuz when I was first introduced to public relations and you know, I’m gonna date myself, you know, of course there was no internet back in 1994 and we were all, you know, [00:04:00] faxing.

Our pitches to journalists, or we were picking up the phone and pitching. And so we represented celebrities. We represented production companies back in the day in Los Angeles, out just outside of Beverly Hills. And, uh, you know, we were working with James Jones and hall Berry, uh, Shirley McClain and others.

And, and for PR in the entertainment sector, what it was was if a celebrity was in a film or on a TV show, They were actively engaged in the production. We were letting the world know we were publicizing them. We were helping them get the word out about the show by having them get onto shows, you know, Jimmy Fallon wasn’t around them, but, uh, Jay Leno and, and others, and, and, you know, uh, Larry King and they would, these celebrities would get on their show and they would talk about their life.

They would talk about, you know, what they’re working on and, you know, people would go, you know, watch their TV shows or see their movies. Now that’s one, one [00:05:00] aspect of it, right? Because that’s, you know, doing PR for a celebrity now doing PR for a startup is very different in, you know, fast forward to 2022.

You know, I don’t think any one of us has effects sheet anymore. If we do, it’s probably in the closet. Uh, now we’re, you know, sending out pitches to a journalist via email and we’re picking up the phone and calling and checking in and seeing if they have interest or if they wanna talk further. And what does that look like?

Well, it varies, you know, PR today could be, you know, a client, a startup is, is announcing they’re raising, you know, $5 million and they want to get the word out that they’ve, they’re about to announce they’ve, they’ve raised $5 million, or maybe they have a, a new product they want to get out in front of folks who are writing about software products, or, you know, maybe they’ve got somebody who joined their team.

Who’s, you know, quite a, a big muckety from a, a previous, you know, successful startup. And they want to get the word out about that. Or maybe, you know, somebody had a good experience. They wanna share that, you know, [00:06:00] is really differentiated versus the competition and, you know, fast company or in crunch and entrepreneur want to hear about that success.

Or, you know, maybe they don’t have news and they wanna do a thought leadership program where they wanna write article. For publications. And so, you know, they’re writing a piece or we’re writing a piece for them that we place in like adventure, beat.com or other publications that take these contributed articles or, or maybe, you know, they, they know that, you know, in a particular magazine, they, you know, and these magazines have, what’s called editorial calendars and there’s upcoming feature stories on specific that we can reach out to.

You can reach out to, you know, those editors who are writing about those feature stories, you know, that are coming out, down the line in the future and ask them, you know, if they’re looking for experts to speak to. So there’s all different kinds of ways to, to, you know, fully focus on PR today. Yeah. I think we got to a lot to unpack in just what you’re talking about right now.

Um, first of all, this [00:07:00] concept of this startup positioning themselves as an expert in their industry so that when a, you know, something comes out or something. You know, new technology or whatever it is, the in the industry media at least would reach out to that startup or the startup in fact, would reach out to the media and say, you know, I have a comment here on this, or a comment on that.

Um, to me that it doesn’t cost a lot to do that. It really doesn’t, it’s really about sharing your knowledge. It’s like clubhouse. Maybe Paulette’s gonna share some knowledge with us on PR and it’s really just getting on stage and letting the, uh, media outlets, especially in your industry, know you exist and what your expertise is.

Can you talk a little bit more about that or, or Jeff? Well, I was gonna add to that comment, you know, a lot of it, and especially for, um, young companies and startups, a lot of PR to this day is, is based on relationships and relationship [00:08:00] building as is most of business, frankly. Um, and one of the things that startups can do, especially if they’re active in participating in, um, you know, some of the pitch events, et cetera, that are covered by the media is really just to establish relationships with the press early on and.

Not so much hitting them so hard with a hard sell on your product, but just getting to know them, letting them get to know you, um, saying hello to them at different events, staying in touch in between keeping them informed and building that relationship. And if you start building that relationship, when the company is young, then as you grow and you’re ready to really launch your products and you really want to turn on the PR, you already have, uh, people who know who you are that will answer your email or pick up the phone or respond to your text.

Um, so relationship building is very important. I remember in the early days of one of the companies I was involved with, um, mixer, you know, we went to the first. Tech crunch and had a chance to, to mingle with a [00:09:00] lot of the reporters from tech crunch at the event, the tech crunch 20, which became the tech crunch 40, uh, and just those relationships paid off in spades over the years because, um, you know, even if it’s hanging out with them at a social event during the conference, so whenever you have an opportunity to meet the press pun intended, um, you want to do so, and it doesn’t always have to be around pitching your product hard.

Don’t forget that it’s about relationship building and I think that’s really important. Yeah. It’s interesting. How many beers have we bought Kevin? Right from domain insight. Oh gosh. How many times yeah, exactly. David, any thoughts on this? Yeah, I’d just like to add to what Jeff is saying, because there’s a, you know, when I was, I was recruited up to the bay area to work with Steve jobs and, and one thing that it’s one of the first things that Steve said to me in, in my face was, you know, these relationships are not yours.

These relationships are my relationships. And he said, and, and very smartly. So, and I knew this and, you know, and, and I I’d [00:10:00] respected this and, and very many PR people think differently than I do on this topic. But the, the, the net net is that, you know, the, the goal of the PR person is to create trusted relationships.

You really wanna be a trusted contact with the journalists that you’re working with. So they know that when you’re reaching out to them, you’re not just some FLA, that’s sending them some, you know, gobble to go that doesn’t relate to them. That you’ve read what they’ve written. You know, you, you really understand what they’re writing about.

And, you know, and in my position, having worked for agencies since 1994 and, and not being inside a company, it’s a little bit different because I’m actually establishing. And then helping maintain a relationship for the client and those relationships are the clients. And, you know, a lot of agencies, I, I I’ve worked with will say, oh, no, no, no, those are your, your relationships.

You know, that’s, that’s your cap, that’s your intellectual property. You know, you don’t want to hand that over to, you know, to your client. But the thing is that the client has the story to tell the, you are helping the client [00:11:00] build that narrative. And at the end of the day, you know, most people that I, and any agency really doesn’t keep a client for, you know, 5, 10, 15 years.

But those companies, you know, if you look@companieslikesalesforce.com, they’re they’re companies that go, you know, live on for a long time. And so it’s their relationships that you’re helping build for them, with them. And the trust that you still early on really helps those people, uh, accelerate to their business objectives.

Yeah. And I’m just gonna add, um, , you know, just in our experience. And actually my husband was a publicist also in LA during that time is if you have that trusted relationship and you do establish yourself as a credible, you know, source, the advantage of that also is that you don’t always have to be reaching out to them.

Reporters will start [00:12:00] reaching out to you because they are actually looking, oh my gosh, you know, I have to fill a docket here. I, I have to get a story out. They’ll start calling the people that they trust. And it becomes a very symbiotic, um, relationship, which is really, you know, can be PR at its best.

Yeah. And they also have a need for speed. Uh, so when you get asked by a journalist to do a report, you know, don’t say I’ll get it to tomorrow. Log them are on a tight. They want it right away, like do that interview right away or give ’em the information right away. Right. Jeff? Yeah. I did want to add a cautionary tale, uh, about the relationship building.

One thing to remember is a good journalist is a journalist first and a friend second. And as you build that relationship, um, keep in mind that no matter what people say at the end of the day, there’s probably no such thing [00:13:00] as off the record. So know that anything you say to a journalist, even a journalist that you’ve begun to get a friendly relationship with may go to print or may go to press or maybe sent out publicly.

And I learned that the hard way early in my career, um, actually my first job outta college and I got, had gotten promot. To vice president, but it hadn’t been announced yet internally at the company, but I was very good friends with the, the two Silverman brothers whose family owned variety at the time.

This was when I was in the entertainment industry. And I was really good friends with mark and Mike Silverman, uh, twins who were the, the, the grandson of the founder of variety and worked for the publication. And so I was hanging out with them after I’d gotten my promotion. Uh, and, and mention it to them saying that don’t, you know, don’t tell anything yet.

Cause it hasn’t been announced publicly and sure enough, the next day it appeared in variety and no one in my company had known about it. And my boss, the CEO of the company was extremely [00:14:00] pissed off and I thought I was gonna lose the promotion over that. So, uh, remember off the record is a very tricky thing.

And your friend who’s a journalist is a journalist first and your friend’s second. Yeah. And you know, one, one thing I wanna add to. You know, I really appreciate all the tips on, you know, reaching out to journalists and, you know, the tips and tricks and going back to the startup and especially the people on clubhouse, you know, and we’ve all been on clubhouse now for, you know, two plus years, these, these folks, they don’t, from what I’ve experienced, they’re not afraid to reach out to journalists.

They’re pretty assertive individuals. They, they, you know, also have publications in mind. They have seen friends or family or other businesses get press. And so it’s not so much about the, the tactics of working with the journalists, as much as it, as I’ve seen the challenge is they don’t know what to say.

And, and so there, the, these, these startups [00:15:00] really struggle with positioning themselves really FA finding, figuring out what their value proposition is. Most of them. Think that they can talk to a customer or a prospect and really run some AB tests and get some feedback. They just kind of willynilly it.

And then, you know, no matter even if they know what the journalist is writing about or, or they have a story to tell it’s just a commercial. And I think that’s where most, almost everybody that I’ve talked to on clubhouse and in startups just fall flat in their face is they don’t take the time to really build out, you know, a positioning document messaging document.

And, you know, you think that it’s something that’s complicated, you know, and you think it’s something that exist. It’s expensive, you know, and to Collins point earlier, it’s just not, I mean, you know, you can go on the internet and type in value proposition, learn what that is. You can go on the internet and type.

Messaging document, get plenty of examples. You can go look at competing companies. You can look at, you know, historical companies that done quite well. You can read books like crossing the chasm by [00:16:00] Jeffrey Moore. You know, there’s all sorts of ways to learn, you know, really how to you build your brand and, and focus on, you know, your customer successes and, you know, well, first of all, where your product market fit is, and then, you know, on your customer success, then market to that and build your, build your company and then publicize it.

You know, if you get out there and you start doing PR for the sake of PR and doing thought leadership and just talking to journalists, you’re was your time. You’re not building your business, you’re just getting PR and you know, it’s, it’s just not a good business strategy. Yeah. And you don’t even have to read Jeffrey Moore.

You cut out.

Colin you cut out. But I think what Colin is saying is that Jeffrey Moore actually appeared right here in a startup club on clubhouse. And there’s a recording of that interview over@startup.club. Been waiting patiently. That’s awesome, Paul. Oh yeah. Thank you. Paul’s been [00:17:00] waiting so patiently. Do you have a tip or trick or a question for David poll?

Thank you so much for having me, everyone, Colin, Michele, David. It’s so good to be here with you all Jeffrey and the other David that’s on the stage. I actually was just popping in to listen, but you peaked my interest. I must say when I started out in college, I actually started out as a PR major. And then I, I switched to communication and more recently having a small business during the pandemic, I’ve learned so many things.

And one of those things that I’ve learned is that I really do have a love for PR. I love it. It just, I, it excites me everything about it. Um, excites me. The work that journalists do is really cool. And what I’ve found is a lot of the things that you’re saying is very true. Now, as a small business, I know the bigger picture, right?

So it’s not the journalist’s job to know. This person is approaching me. They, they are, you know, they have this going on and they have those things going on. They have this business, it would be great. It’s my job to, [00:18:00] to put the pieces together for them. And so I think when we’re talking about the, you know, Hey, I, I know how to pitch, I, I don’t have a problem reaching out, but it’s just when I get to that point, when I reach out and when I send the message, what do I.

I think one of the tips that I have is to be ready and to be quick and to be swift, right? So you have to be ready with all your offers. Don’t say, Hey, I got this kind of like the commercial you were talking about this, I got this product. And I think it’d be really great for your audience. Well, they don’t care.

Everybody has a product that they think would be great for that person’s audience. I like to look at it as a value for value proposition. So if I’m asking a journalist for something, if I’m reaching out for something, if I want coverage, then I’m, I’m asking for something. But also I know what the give is.

Right? I know that I’m giving something to their community. I know I have something to offer their audience. I know that I’m gonna make them look good. Right? I’m gonna give them something because I’m asking for something and it’s that value for value? I feel like people miss a lot. It’s me, me, me, me, me.

It’s my show. My show. [00:19:00] I have this, I have this look at this, look at this, and then you don’t even come. Correct. So when you do go in with that value for value mindset, I think then you also, like I said, wanna have your offer ready? So here’s what I’m trying to pitch. Here are the details. Any links or any things that, you know, that would be helpful because they don’t have time to look.

I mean, the reality is they get pitched a lot. They don’t have time to look. Now I personally have been successful. I call it a DIY PR , I’ve been successful kind of just learning but building relationships. And so I have relationships with large media, you know, news out here in my state, but also, I mean, quite fun and build relationships with drew Barrymore, my daughter, and I got flown out to her show.

And it’s exactly what you guys were talking about, building the relationships, making it make sense, and then having a good value for value proposition that works for both sides and not just going in with that. I have something I want you to have, you know, your audience to know about it. It’s gonna be great.

And me, me, me. So I think [00:20:00] those are the tips that I would add, but honestly, I’m just excited to be around you all because although I didn’t go into PR. I love it. There’s so many cool things about it, but at the court, it is truly for me, like I said, relationship building and really finding a way to provide value, um, but also to give value.

So thank you so much for having me. I’m gonna stick around and listen, but you know, I would love to jump in with some of the things that I’ve done on my own. Kind of like, I call it a DIY P because I feel like we’ve, we’ve been really successful in getting media coverage for myself, for my daughter. And now for, I do it for my girls, my girl scout troop, and getting coverage for them too.

So thank you all so much. This is Paulette. I’m gonna go ahead and yield my mic, Paulette. You, you raised some really great points there and thank you, especially about, you know, the giving. To the reporter as well. And one thing that’s changed dramatically since probably when David and I started out, um, when we were mailing press releases and envelopes, and the whole company had to stuff envelopes and send out those press releases, um, today, especially with online publications, even major ones, even the New York [00:21:00] times and the wall street journal, they often have the writers email address right there next to the article.

So finding out how to contact. A journalist is a lot easier than it used to be. But the thing is, if you’re gonna reach out to them by that publicly available email address, so many other people are too, it’s so important to actually read what they write, find out the things that are of interest to them.

And then if you’re going to talk about your company, you want to do it in a way that matches their interests. So, you know, read the past articles by that reporters, cuz typically reporters have a certain angle they like to pursue. Uh, and it’s pretty apparent if you read a lot of what they’ve written and then you want to position your pitch to them, to feed that need to feed the desire that they have to feed the things that they like to write about the angles that they like to write about and all of that’s readily available.

It’s just a matter of taking the time to do it and think it. thank you for that. Can I also [00:22:00] add too? Don’t be afraid to throw someone a bone, right? Like, uh, there was a, a major story that happened here out in my area, and it was a really tragic story and I knew someone connected to it. And so I knew that none of the other news outlets had done coverage on it.

And I said to one of the individuals involved in this tragedy, I said, Hey, you know, if you would like to get your side of the story out, I know someone who you could contact. I know, you know, someone who may be interested in helping you, so by me helping them, right. I was able to provide value to the reporter by handing her over on a silver platter, a story that no one else had.

And so those are opportunities where you then again, build that relationship and build that rapport it’s value for value. So it’s not here comes Paulette with an ask it’s here comes Paulette. I wonder if she has an ask or a gift. Thank you so much. Yeah, it’s interesting. You talked about that because sometimes the best PR comes at the most unlikely times.[00:23:00] 

Uh, and I remember, uh, back in the nineties, when we had an is S P and our lines got cut, we had about 600 phone lines and we were pretty much out of business because I mean, they physically cut. There was an, the, they were doing some construction and, and they in, you know, in, they, in inadvertently cut the lines and, you know, a hundred thousand people on in Toronto at the time were on the internet, on our service.

And we were like out of business. And so we all gathered around in the boardroom and said, okay, what are we gonna do? And I said, well, what can we do? Let’s write a press release and send it out in the next hour. Well, I’ll tell you, it was, I listened to the radio station, six 80 news. There wasn’t an hour that went by.

They didn’t talk about internet direct in that, in that service, then mafia, boy hit us. That was a big one. We were on national news around that one. And then even with our small incubator, we had a, a hurricane tore the roof off. It was a disaster, our building shut down. I got my son, we got a, uh, a drone. We Dred it.

We took some [00:24:00] photos and we sent them off to the me, the newspaper and they, and they printed an article about it. So sometimes the most unlikely times, David, any thoughts on that before we jump to you, David, number two on stage, but any thoughts, David? Uh, this David yes, exactly. This more than one David John on stage.

Yeah. Cause you know, that’s just the way the world worked. David’s Michael’s Stevens. Um, yeah, that’s, that’s a really good point. Colin. And I think that, you know, and also to Paul’s point, you know, there there’s a, there’s a organization called, um, hero. You, you know, help a reporter out. There’s another one called ProfNet where, you know, journalists are looking for on the fly opportunities.

You know, they’re writing about something that’s trending, that’s hot in the news and they need somebody to speak to it or in your case, You know, you were, you know, following the trend right. And you really played to it and you got lucky and that, that right place at the right time. And a lot of it has to do with timing.

And on, on one hand, I, I think that’s a, another PR [00:25:00] strategy that does work, you know, especially if you’re in an emerging market and, you know, it’s in NFT or it’s, you know, a blockchain or it’s, you know, it’s something else that’s really hot right now, uh, or, you know, something specific to your actual local market.

Um, the, but the other thing that I, that I push our clients on is really developing a PR strategy. And that is a part of the PR strategy, but I, you know, I always really wanna help folks just recognize that it’s so important to really try to control your own narrative. And I, I think you did a good job for what you said on that one.

Um, and then I would think, okay, what’s next? And what’s next is, you know, looking at your PR strategy. Okay. So what’s the next press release. What’s the next round of stories you’re gonna put out, you know, how are you gonna. You know, upsell, you know, your company, your, uh, you know, and, and show more and show growth.

And that’s really what it comes down to. I think for a lot, a lot of these startups is they, they don’t do this and they should, and I’m saying, should they should focus on [00:26:00] growth? They should focus on marketing their growth. If you look at, you know, we’ve had a number of clients that have been acquired or IPOed.

And the reason that some of these folks are successful is because they have not been shy. And they’ve, they’ve, you know, like you, they focus on following the trends, but like you, they also focus on growth and they publicized their growth. And they did it in over a period of time, over quarters, over years.

And it wasn’t something that, you know, all of a sudden there was, you know, an opportunity. They wanted to jump onto that surfboard and show everybody what a great wave they rode. They became the professional surfer on the, on, you know, on that beach, in that part of the ocean. And, you know, Built a brand name for themselves and everybody who wanted to come see them surf.

So I, I don’t think there’s a, uh, one stop shop for doing PR. I think it’s, you know, there’s an integrated approach from, you know, creating that messaging and the, you know, really identifying your value proposition and your differentiation to how you communicate that across various PR vehicles, whether it’s, you know, jumping onto a trend [00:27:00] or seeing what reporters are writing about or just pitching or writing articles, it just depends upon what your business goals are.

Yeah. And so how many press releases, like, is it normal for a startup to do per year or per month or like, is it, should we be doing one a week? Should we be doing one a month? Like, I guess it has to be newsworthy or else you’ll diminish your brand. Is that correct? Yeah. And then I’m curious to hear, Jeffrey’s take on this too.

I mean, because the, you know, us, us folks who have been doing this for quite some time, you know, come from the camp where once upon a time, there were a lot more reporters and a lot more folks covering a lot more beats beats, meaning different, you know, aspects of different kinds of, uh, sectors and, and organizations.

And, and so, you know, we would send out a press release as an FYI and, you know, it’s really hard to do that today. You know, the journalists there, there’s just not enough of ’em, there’re not enough people covering enough types of stories. They [00:28:00] don’t want the FYI. Um, you know, even folks that I know will call me up and ask me to speak to a particular client, aren’t calling up the lays FYI, they’re calling because they’re working on a story, they’re on a deadline.

They wanna know if they, you know, we’ve got somebody they can speak to, you know, in FYI, just sending them a press release will cloud, you know, really pack up their inbox and it’s not relative what they’re doing. So, you know, to your point to just send out something for the sake of sending it out is a mistake.

I know a lot of companies that just wanna create news cause they don’t have any mistake, you know, and I’m being pretty hard here. I mean, I’m pretty being, I’m not usually this direct. Um, but I, you know, I kind, I kind of had it with like, you know, the companies and the PR people that are just, you know, crowding up the space and making it harder for everybody else.

And pissing off reporters are really ruining PR and really not understanding how journalism works because you know, a news story is as easy as looking. You know, if, if you’re an artificial intelligence and you’re looking at what the latest news [00:29:00] is, you know, type in artificial intelligence and news, or type in artificial intelligence and click on the news button on Google.

And you’ll see what these reporters are writing about as it relates to artificial intelligence and look at yourself and your company and say, you know, do I have something that’s newsworthy? Could I have a story like this? And if so, I can create a press release and, and versus looking at it from maybe I should be creating two press releases a month, which all startups say to me.

And I’m like, yeah, sure. Okay. Let’s cross that bridge when we get to it. Cuz will you really have news? Well, we got a new product coming out and I’m like, yeah, do you, is it, is it something that’s really redefining something that’s, you know, a journalist would wanna write about? Or is it just something that you’re playing catch up with in a market or in some cases with a cyber security company we represented, they thought they didn’t have a.

Um, they didn’t have an announcement. And when I did research, I found, wow, heck around the RSA conference, which is one of the biggest cyber security conferences out there, security conferences, you know, there were at least six people that could write about that news. And they were shocked that we got all six pieces of coverage for them because, you know, they, they [00:30:00] thought, oh, they didn’t have anything.

They were just playing catch up. But even though they were paying catch up and they were doing something that their competitors had already done, they competitors hadn’t done it like that. So there’s that too. So you only really have to understand the nuances and then, then, and then back it up from there and say, okay, is this really gonna be a press waste that we wanna really create and worth getting out?

Dave? Yeah, David, it it’s, it’s really, um, really good points. And the thing is too, especially now with the. You know, a lot of companies will put out a lot of press releases. They’re never gonna get articles written, uh, based on those press releases, they’re doing it simply, um, to have them being picked up by the wires and they’ll be rep repeated places.

And if someone does a Google search for the company, you know, it’s likely that one of those press releases will pop up, but that’s a lot different from having a reporter, take the news that’s in your press release and actually writing an article about it. And there’s much more value in, in getting those articles written.

And to your point, David, that’s only gonna happen [00:31:00] when you have real news and not just fluff so that you have an excuse to put out another press release and get that pickup through the, um, wires online. But you brought up a really good point too. Jeffrey is that, you know, if you create a press release, you don’t have to send it to a journalist.

You could put it on PR web.com for 400 bucks. And what does that do for you? That could really up level your SEO. And so that’s another. Right. Another strategy that and tactic that a PR person could help a company do that, you know, could help their overall business, which kind of backs up to what I said earlier, which is, you know, if you’ve got your messaging, you’ve got your value pro you’re creating all this content, you know, that’s the redefinition of public relations and communications too, right?

It’s not just about reaching out to journalists. So I’m, I’m really glad you brought that up. Jeffrey. Thank you. And you can do both. You can do both because you can send out the release on the wire and then the people that you do have relationships with, then you can send them something personal, attach the press release and say, I just wanted to give [00:32:00] you a heads up.

We just put out this press release, or this is going out tomorrow morning. If you wanna give someone a scoop, you know, and then you could leverage both sides of that fence. Do you mind Ryan? Yeah. Ryan, we’ll jump. We’ll jump onto you. Just real, real fast, but, uh, in a minute, but David was up next. I do wanna give him a chance, but you’re right after him.

All right. Is that okay, Ryan? Gosh. Yeah, of course. Sorry. My mistake. Yeah, no problem. And we’re excited that you’re, you came and you joined us here really excited that you thank you. Um, and I was gonna add to that last conversation that we had an Amazon expert in here. Once that said it actually helps you in the search engine results as well.

If you’re PR if you put out a press release, now that being said, a press release for press release, you know, just to put it out there. I don’t know if it’s necessarily worth it, but if you actually get a new story, I know, and you have some links or some domain name in that, um, article, uh, those back links can help your SEO.

David, thank you for being patient. And then next to you, Ryan. No, my pleasure. Thanks guys for having me on stage today in a happy Friday. Um, so as, as a startup founder, looking at this to a startup founder’s [00:33:00] lens specifically, um, I would say, uh, it’s definitely important to add into your strategy, uh, a PR component and what we did and what you’re gonna find is nowadays in the advent of digital media, there’s a lot of digital periodicals, if you will, that are circulating locally.

So we’re in Miami and there’s two or three that have. Features regularly on, on local brands. So one reached out to me, us, and then one I reached out to so it’s actually very easy or not easy, but it’s easier now to find a periodical that wants to do a feature on you. So that’s one, two is to get a feature done again, it’s not difficult, but it’s important for two reasons.

One discovery, because once that happens, that Jeffrey alluded to you’re on, you’re on a, a Google search now, so people can find you by just your website, but also those articles. So discovery happens, uh, uh, more, more advantageously, but then also. On validation was even more important. People, again, who are in the BDC space like myself against customers are smart.

They’re gonna research your company. They’re gonna see who you are, what you’re about. Especially if you’re new, they’re gonna spend money on your products. They wanna know who you are, [00:34:00] if you’re, if you’re legitimate. So if they go online and there’s research your website and also see this three or four articles written about you, the validation piece is check the check, mark, uh, checkbox is marked.

So they’re like, okay, this brand is legit. They’ve got nice products. Website seems legitimate. Um, there’s articles are written, blah, blah, blah. So from that perspective, it’s really important, I think, to, to put that in your, in your initiatives, but, um, from, from just a, a, a sourcing perspective again, locally, uh, it’s not that difficult.

If you find local digital media, uh, outlets that you can tap into, but then. But with in industry perspective, again, not as difficult as people think you, if you reach out to again, but the advent of social media, it’s easy to find kind of the, uh, the editor for, uh, the athletic piece. And let’s say, as, for example, footwear news is a big periodical for us.

And so I found the guy who runs the, the athletic side, this footwear specifically, and, uh, reached out to him a few years back and we’re working on doing a piece. Now it’s in the it’s in process, but again, I reached out to him and, uh, he reached out back to me. And, uh, and if you have an interest. Company value propositions, you present to those, those industry, [00:35:00] uh, periodical experts.

Um, they’re more than willing usually to, to listen to you and see if you have, uh, something interesting they wanna, uh, write about and get to Collins’s point. They’re looking for articles to write about they need content. They wanna find interesting companies to do, to do spreads on. So it’s a hundred percent true.

If you reach out to them, you have something compelling and interesting and a good value proposition you present to them. Something that’s kind of exciting. Um, they’re gonna wanna do, uh, an article on you so you can get, at least at the very least, uh, uh, uh, you know, an abbreviated, uh, piece written on you or even an expanded piece that goes into all details about your company, about you, about your background and whatnot.

So it’s definitely available to you if you just do a little bit of work, but I would say that, uh, definitely add that to your, to your list of initiatives as a startup day one. Yeah. I just wanna jump on that call. I know that’s right. This is David, the other David . So one, one speaking to what David said, one thing, another, another trend today is today is David let be frustrated today.

just, you know, I’m coming off of cover. So I have all this energy thankfully, but one of the things that I’ve [00:36:00] noticed, and, but David’s point is, is please, please, please. As a startup, do what he said, you know, cuz so many of the startups that we work with only focus on the. Vertical, you know, like, so like, you know, if they’re a supply chain, companies are focused on supply chain, trade publications, or they’re talking about the wall street journal in New York times, they’re not talking about their local publications and why should they be right?

Well, you’re not just thinking about, you know, getting more business. You’re also looking at attracting new employees. They’re also looking at attracting potential new investors and folks who wanna invest. And you might literally be in your backyard because they wanna support the companies in their backyard.

And so to David’s point, absolutely 100% have a multi-pronged strategy. And that, you know, I think is the value of having all these people onstage have had all this experience is that you you’re right now, you’re getting such a big wealth of, you know, like you don’t, you’re not just being served. The Ordos you’re, we’re saying here’s your Ordos here’s the meal.

[00:37:00] Here’s the dessert. You can actually come up with a whole PR strategy that covers all these areas that you can execute over a short period and a long period of time. Thank you. Great. And, uh, we have another expert Ryan, uh, on stage here. Uh, again, thank you for coming, Ryan, do you have some thoughts on this topic?

I do. First of all, thank you very much for having me. And second of all, apologies for not understanding the PT order that you are moving in. I am currently working on a crisis management strategy for Coca-Cola after they released an international ad targeted at gamers, which received quite the backlash.

And I was knee deep in that, but I had to pause and contribute to this conversation first and foremost, because as you are well aware, there’s a lot of word salad on clubhouse and a lot of people who love the sound of their own voice. And so I appreciated that we were getting down to the nitty gritty and [00:38:00] offering real actionable, tangible advice.

So I suppose my Tibit for what it’s worth is. Obviously, and I think this is probably important for the room to understand anyone who doesn’t understand this is that PR is multifunctional in as much as it serves lots of different purposes and PR is a very broad term. And so in the context of the question, how much PR should you be investing in or how many press releases a week should a startup be investing in?

I would highly suggest working backwards. From your specific marketing objectives. Let me quantify that and give you some examples. So for example, if you are a startup who is currently in the stages of brand strategy, as every new business should be before the endeavor into marketing strategy, then I suppose it’s relevant to engage in some brand related PR.

For [00:39:00] example, some things I say to my clients is it may be worth investing 3000 pounds in our media placement with Forbes or entrepreneur or business insider. Not because it will necessarily result in any. Quantifiable leads or indeed business, but actually it’s a great brand piece. And as far as when you do endeavor in farther digital marketing strategy and you receive organic traffic to your very vast brand touchpoints, you can plaster that associated logo of Forbes or in Truman or business insider on your brand touchpoints and psychologically, that has a very profound effect in the context of brand education and brand awareness.

That’s the first example, I suppose, the second example which David touched on so eloquently was perhaps you have come through that hurdle and you have specific SEO objectives. And if you’re a business that doesn’t have SEO objectives, I highly suggest that you re-strategize and, and think about [00:40:00] SEO because depending on your industry and sector, Successful SEO should be accounting for 64% on average of your leads in the B2B space and, uh, converting it for 14% and for free.

And so of course, PR in the context of working backwards from your SEO objectives is great in terms of achieving back links and helping engage those over 200 ranking factors that Google takes into account when ranking your pages. And of course the first five results and in a search result on Google avail, 70% of all traffic.

So it’s really important. So if that’s your objective, then there’s a specific PR strategy to cert. And I suppose the final example I’ll give. Uh, a general, uh, brand awareness and brand education. Objective say, you’ve nailed your SEO. You’ve nailed your brand strategy. And the reality is that you have company news, which, uh, you want to release in order to keep you [00:41:00] present in the minds of your perspective audiences.

So when somebody who, as David said earlier is applying for a job or is a prospective client, or who’s just generally interested when they are searching for you, then they can see up to date, current relevant. Press releases that relate to the wins in your business, be a key hire or a new client, or an event that you’re holding that help them understand that you’re still a relevant business.

So those are just three different PR strategies that I’ve worked backwards from different objectives. And I just think it’s an important clarification to make that PR is a broad term and there are specific strategies and PR strategies that should be worked backwards from specific objectives. And startups is also a broad term and, and startups may have different objectives.

And, um, I think the reality is first look at what objectives you wanna achieve, then engaging the correct PR strategy and then set your KPIs [00:42:00] accordingly. I’m Ryan and I’m finished speaking. All right, Ryan, I have to ask you was new. PR disaster or was it some type of stunt too? I don’t know. I hated it when it happened.

I think it was mid eighties. If I, I don’t remember, or nineties, you might be too young to remember, but the jury’s out there are whisperings in the office that it was a calculated PR stunt. And I have to say in the context of what I’m working on now, Um, Coca-Cola released an advert, a very, very, very lucrative, expensive advert, internationally to target gamers.

It’s called the real magic of Coke. If you wanna have a look at it. And, uh, the general reception was exceptional. We’ve got a really, really positive general reception, but the reception from gamers, the actual audience that they were trying to engage with was abysmal, abysmal so much so that they actually took it down.

And then re-uploaded it. So they’ve come to, uh, my agency to, to curate, uh, a crisis management strategy and rebalance the ship [00:43:00] if you will. So yeah, if you’re interested to have a look at the real manage of Coke and, and as non-gamers, you may love it, but then have a look at the drum article and see why gamers hate it.

It’s really interesting reading. I really appreciate you sharing your time, given your crisis. You’re dealing with David. Any thoughts on Ryan’s? What Ryan was talking about? Oh boy, crisis communications is a whole nother, another room calling. Right. And I, and I really appreciate Ryan and he’s so well spoken and I, we, we shared many rooms together, even over the weekends.

And so thank you for your contribution. Yeah. You know, it’s, it’s, it’s not just PR with NewCo, right? It’s a whole marketing, marketing, uh, commitment. And, you know, when I was working with brands like that, ancestry and Nestle and, uh, general motors back in the day, you know, they’re, it’s, they’re, they’re 800 pound gorillas.

So, you know, they’re, they, when they put go in, they go in pretty big and, you know, to pull out examples from those kinds of experience from startups is, is challenging, right? Because you know, the startups in a [00:44:00] different space, but you know, at, at the same time, you know, if you’re, you’re looking to be aspirational and you wanna be that, you know, new Coke or you wanna be acquired by Coke, it’s certainly important to follow what those beverage companies do.

Awesome. Michele, can you, uh, I will be listening for the next 15 minutes, but can you, uh, take over, uh, I know you had a couple questions and I know we got you SIM in the audience as well. Yeah, absolutely. Um, you know, I’ve done a little crisis PR myself and, you know, I, I know this might sound weird, but in a way it can actually help you out.

Right? Because like yourself scenario, my company was in is that we, you know, hit it head on very honestly. And it actually, um, gave us, uh, you know, a lot of, um, I’ll say endearment to our customers. So I think that’s, like you said, it’s like this whole other big topic, [00:45:00] but you can turn things around quite oftentimes.

If you do it in a very direct, sincere way and really take care of the problem, it can actually, um, somewhat kind of help you I’ll say so on that note, um, let’s get down to Yasin and then I think we can open up for each other. So Yasin.

Michele you were, um, you were breaking up when you were sharing. Did you wanna like, say it one more time, just so everyone can hear you? Sure. I think I’m having a connectivity issue, but yeah, I was just saying, I have worked at and been in a leadership positions at a couple of companies that had, um, crisis.

Um, and the point is there, if you do handle it correctly very directly and sincerely, and really do take care of the problem, it [00:46:00] can end up being a positive thing. So on that note, um, let’s get right over to you Yamen, so that,

okay. Thank you so much, Michele, David, everyone. Um, so I, my question is that. I need to get pressed from high authority publications for, um, for my work visa. So it’s very, very specific. And, um, I, the angle I’ve been taking, which helped me get featured once at fors, um, aid week and, you know, some like more second three tier, uh, publications was, um, and that’s something I had learned from a PR course is that literally, you know, that I need [00:47:00] to, um, you know, search research, the editors in the field I am in, which is, you know, social media consult.

So let’s say a Forbes editor that, um, you know, writes about social media and then, you know, to reach out to them and then, you know, basically tell them the angle of a story, like to pitch a story. Um, now I, as I said, I was lucky like that I was featured once at Forbes, but I’ve been trying the last six months and, you know, Forbes or the other, um, higher authority publications.

It’s just not working anymore. And I don’t feel like hero works anymore. Cause, um, you know, just too well, I hear frustrations from like also the press that [00:48:00] they just like get too many things from there. So they even ignore it anyway. So. My question is, is there any other way maybe that I can pitch other than, you know, um, let’s say it’s someone, it forms women and I am telling them, Hey, you know, I would like to contribute.

I mean, I have an article idea as to how this new feature on LinkedIn is gonna really help women, uh, you know, in leadership, uh, get even more visibility or sorry. Like my example’s not very sexy, but you get the idea. Um, or maybe I wasn’t able to express myself well, in which case, please do ask me, [00:49:00] um, So, let me start there, like, is, is, is it clear what I’m trying to accomplish?

Yes, it is very clear what you’re trying to accomplish to me. Yeah. Thank you. Jaine ha you have a, a history of supporting women in, in being, and participating in women, led organizations.

Um, well I well participating. Yes. And, uh, well, I wasn’t a leader, but, huh. Okay. That’s an interesting angle. Um, yeah, so, you know, I think that, and, and I’m sorry, I don’t mean to put you on this spot. I should have asked that question differently. So my apologies, I, well, what I’m, what I’m trying to communicate to you is that, you know, being a woman of course helps, right.

You know, Right. No one knows, you know, better than your experience, your own personal experience. [00:50:00] Now being actively involved in organizations that help support other women is also really positive because that would, could potentially show a journalist that, you know, you’re really, you know, inside and really understand just the collective, the brain trust around what women are really experiencing and you know, how you’ve been helpful and how they’ve helped you and being a social media expert as you are.

And I, I think I know you’re quite long enough and well enough to know that you’re quite talented at what you’re doing and, and very outspoken and very thoughtful and, and, and just very collaborative and helpful. And, you know, you’ve got all the good qualities of, of what I would think a journalist would want to who and a journalist want to hear.

You could leverage your social media experience and go to Twitter. And if you haven’t already really start following the women and the men, quite frankly, who are writing about women and social media are women entrepreneurs, or LinkedIn and women on LinkedIn. And to start interacting with them on. On Twitter and, and, you [00:51:00] know, start developing a relationship and goes back to what Jeffrey was saying about how relationships matter, because, you know, once you start developing those relationships with those journalists on these social media networks, they’ll get to know you as well.

Somebody who really is really a champion for women and look what you’re doing and look what you’re talking about. And you’re building a real brand around, you know, this, this particular initiative and cause it’s really, you know, passionate to you and you’re not just doing it for yourself, you really wanna help other women.

And so I think that will really come across and then when the time is right, you know, they’ll reach out to you as a resource or if they ask, you know, on Twitter, you know, they’re doing a story about women entrepreneurs or, you know, what do women think about, you know, their presence on LinkedIn? You know, you, if you comment, you know, of course they’re gonna reach out to you.

Or pay attention to what you’re saying, because you’ve been communicating with them all that time. Now you could try to do that via email as well, um, by providing them with some thoughts and feedback, you know, Hey, Hey, I saw your article, you wrote about this. And I just wanted to give you my position on this or my thoughts, or, Hey, [00:52:00] did you see this?

That might be helpful as well. Um, so that’s another way that you could potentially do it. Or if you had some sort of relationship with a leading women organization where you were participating, um, beyond, uh, attending and you were, you know, on the board or you were had some sort of, you know, executive position that too may also helped you with, you know, a particular journalist.

Let’s say if the, if that group has a survey they’re releasing about, you know, what women are really going through as they, you know, are, are being really, um, valued or not valued on these social media platforms or in business in general. And so, you know, there’s, there’s, those are three different ways that you could approach it.

I’m sure the folks on stage have other ways they’d like to share, but those are just a few ways you might wanna consider. Thank you so much, David. And, um, so you, what you just described is what I’ve been doing. And it got me, so it’s not getting me success with the, like, let’s say the forms in [00:53:00] entrepreneur type of publications, which is the requirement for the visa.

Um, and I think the reason is, you know, and I am not even just focusing on, you know, Forbes women, but literally like all the different angles that relate, I dunno, Forbes innovation, cause you know, there’s no social media section. So, you know, I have been following them like on Twitter, LinkedIn, you know, doing this, you know, the, the engagement strategy that you just described.

I, so I guess the reason it doesn’t work with them, Is because there are so many people who are doing it and they are like, you know, they already have so many followers, so many commands that my command does not get seen. Right. And that’s, and that, that goes back to a point that I made earlier is that, you know, it’s really, really hard to [00:54:00] do PR if you haven’t yet build up a brand presence, build up a real, a lot of content and equity around where you’re focusing.

Because if you, you know, for example, tomorrow say, you know, I have an angle and you pitch that angle then. Oh, sure. Someone might wanna speak to you. You know, what are you gonna speak to really, you know, and you can speak to that particular angle, but you really have to be invested in it, have, have real world experience dealing with it for someone to really, you know, feature you at that level.

And, and it could be as, as simple, I say, simple with the air quotes and that you have a customer, you know, a woman customer who you really helped out and you really made a difference for her. And, you know, she’s the story for these top tier publications. And she then talks about how wonderful you were in helping her get to where she wants to be.

So, you know, but it depends upon the publication that you’re [00:55:00] pitching these top tier folks do like to get real world case studies where these customers can really disclose, you know, who they are, what success they’ve had, how it impacted their growth. And so that there’s that also I’m, I’m not understanding how it relates to you.

Getting approved for a visa. If, if that’s really the case, then you can always spend like 1800 to $2,000 and buy, you know, a, a, uh, a relationship with Forbes where you have a regular, you know, you’re a regular contributor. If they accept you to be one and you can write for them a weekly or monthly, and that may be, you know, an opportunity for, for you that may.

You know, solidify your visa application, but I just, it’s hard for me to believe that a visa application would be somewhat dependent upon you getting press or because, you know, it’s, it’s so much such an impossibility for so many people. It’s almost unfair, you know, that a visa, the organization, you know, right.

The [00:56:00] visa application organization would be requiring that. So maybe I’m misunderstanding. And I know we’re getting pretty close to Dr. Two here, but David, trust me, they are like the, the, I have been working towards that fulfilling the requirements of that work permit for two years, they make it like.

Ridiculously difficult. Uh, but yeah, your understanding’s correct. And that’s, that’s just one of the 20 requirements, which all of them are difficult, but, uh, just one question about what you said. Um, so it, this story does not have to be about like how successful or great I am. You know, I managed to get featured on Forbes once before, and that was an ed week.

I don’t know if ed week’s first year, but, um, It was more like, you know, there are, so the one angle that I can [00:57:00] come up with that I learned is, you know, let’s say something changes on one of the social media platforms. Okay. Let’s say if the, um, if the, if the, um, magazine is entrepreneur, you know, it’s for entrepreneurs.

So I think of, okay, what are the implications of this? Let’s say new change on Instagram. On entrepreneurs. I don’t know, getting visibility, maybe small businesses, you know, like on entrepreneurs in general. It’s um, can I deliver you a really difficult truth in as much as I have the privilege of having insight with regards to the inner workings of Forbes and entrepreneur and magazines like it, and it’s because at my agency we have senior contributors.

And so I’m in touch with some of the major purchasing decision makers at the likes of, for and entrepreneur. And I’m just gonna explain to you a couple of [00:58:00] things. The first thing is that I’ve been told that 98% of the articles that they publish both online and in print are paid for media placements.

And that’s because their entire business model has changed. And as much as they used to be paid for by advertising, but now they don’t have the same pool. And so unfortunately the way that they function, the way they make money is through people who want to utilize their brand to align with their own brand and be associated with it for the purposes of strategic brand PR.

Um, that’s the first thing. So I, unfortunately, bobs, you can have the best angle. You can have the best angle and the best experience, and it can be interesting and unique. And the reality is that you will not be accepted to feature. And that article will not be written because capital is king, [00:59:00] unfortunately, and it does not make them money.

And so really the only route to market now to be published in the likes of Forbes and entrepreneur is to pay for it. It’s as simple as that. And I wish it wasn’t the case, but it is the case. And so for example, many, many of our clients or people come to me and they say, I wanna be featured in Forbes. And I’m just really honest with them saying, okay, well, first of all, they will only publish an article on individuals, not businesses necessarily.

So you can talk about you as an individual and the angle could be, why should all entrepreneurs speak, um, study psychology that was published about me. And then in that you can talk a little bit about your business. That’s the first thing I say to them. And the second thing I say to three grand, and that’s the reality,

the truth, but if you wanna be published and Forbes and entrepreneur, you have to go through an agency that has a contact with a senior [01:00:00] contributor who can write an article about you with a specific angle, speaking a little bit about your business, and then you have to pay three grand for it. That’s really the only route to mark.

Unfortunately. Right. Or you could find a contributor on link or you could find a contributor on LinkedIn. Absolutely. And to, and I, I know we’re at the top of the hour here and I’ll hand it back to Michele, but it’s just, you know, it’s very interesting to me that so much of the PR these days is pay for play.

You know, whether it’s, you know, a business publication like Forbes or entrepreneur, or if it’s a business publication, like a trade, a trade publication, this is how they play. And that’s been that way for, gosh, I wanna say at least 10 years now, at least 10 years. So, all right back to calling Michele, I was gonna add, uh, that, you know, startup do club is new, and if it’s a visa requirement, he wouldn’t have to pay anything.

We’d be happy to take blogs from you or any stories you’d wanna write about, uh, in any case spec you, Michele, I know you’re running it. Uh, yeah. I, you know, I think it kind of gets back to, [01:01:00] you know, don’t dismiss non Forbes level kind of publications. There’s a lot of really good publications out there that have extremely strong follow.

Um, that you could probably get published in. Um, of course we’re building out our website and we have a massive amount of content, but you know, contact me. And if there’s, you know, a show you wanna do that is about the subject that you could compliment with an nice written blog. We we’d be happy to try to help you.

All right. Thank you. Thank you so much, Michele, Colin, David, um, Ryan as well. And just a quick question, Ryan and Colin, you mentioned reaching out to contributors, but I heard that actually forms fired a lot of those contributors who were taking money to pay people. So you know that it’s really not legal [01:02:00] now that that’s why.

I mean, so are you saying it’s actually not so, and it would be okay if I need to contribute, let us just kind of wrap this up. They’re really, really good questions. And maybe you could reach out to a couple of the folks here. They’re actually formal programs. It it’s not payola or anything illegal it’s it’s formal programs that anyone is open to participate in.

So this has been an amazing hour, you know, I’m so grateful on behalf of club, you know, um, startup club and our members. For this amazing session with David and Ryan joining us, I, I almost feel like Colin, we could do a part two of this. Um, there’s so many quest. I feel like we gotta do exactly. Well, we gotta bring Ryan and David.

Right. And David and David didn’t. Yes. Him as well. I mean, it was great that you [01:03:00] contributed that way. It was a really good show. I, I feel like we barely scratched the surface. I know, like I had so many things I would’ve loved to talk about also as it has to do with content and social media, because those are such open, uh, forums.

So I think we better start wrapping up here, but Colin let’s, um, let’s schedule another session to continue this conversation. If, um, we can get David and Ryan to join us. So David and Ryan, um, we’ll send you either a direct message here through the app or an email. If we have your email and get something on the books.

But gosh, you know, I, I really appreciate this session hearing from both of you and other folks in the audience that are really, um, expert on this. And I believe that there’s been so many, he, uh, tips, excuse me, that are gonna help our members here. So be sure to [01:04:00] follow our, um, website and our email list, which is@wwwdotstartup.club.

We will be posting some of these tips up there as well as have recordings. And we will be getting another session on the calendar. So Colin, why don’t you close us up? And, um, I think that’s it for this week. Yeah. And I think next week we’re talking about platforms and it’s my favorite type of business subscription platforms and the realities of launching one.

and I truly believe they’re such great businesses, but they take a long time. So we’re gonna have two individuals who, who spent the last eight years building their digital platforms and selling subscriptions. And, uh, they’re gonna be on talking with us about tho that business model on startup club and definitely checkout startup.club and sign up to that email list.

We have so many great [01:05:00] speakers coming on next month, which you won’t know about it unless you sign up to the email list. Thank you everyone. I know. I, I followed, uh, you Ryan. I don’t think I was following you until today. I just, this first time, I think I’ve actually met you or a second time, but I’m definitely following you now, Ryan and Paulette and you see, and David and David, and then being the audience feels like they should follow.

Please, please give them a follow as well. That it was a great, great show. Thank you very much. Thank you everybody. Thank you, Colin. Thank you, Michel. Thank you everyone. And if I can be of help, uh, please let me know as well, like this topic. I know I can give you more insights later, but I know a lot of people want the help on this topic.

And just like, I believe it was David who was saying it earlier that a lot of people are giving advice, but they are like, yeah, they are giving advice that really does not work. And I’m happy to share like more details so you can make, you know, we can really get a lot more people to the room. So [01:06:00] I’m very happy to help you get more visibility for the room as well, especially around the PR to, because I know a lot of people are looking for it.

Thank you very much again. Yep. It’s a community. Thank you. We really appreciate it. Have a wonderful weekend and please be well, it’s a community. Thank.